April 5, 1968-April 8, 1968
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| Dr. Knight | Could I point something out to you? | 0:03 |
| You say, make a stand as though I had | 0:06 | |
| taken no stand in these matters. | 0:09 | |
| - | What about the country club? | 0:12 |
| Huck | Where do you stand on country club? | 0:16 |
| What about it? | 0:18 | |
| (people talking over each other) | 0:19 | |
| Dr. Knight | (breath on mic) are the depths of | 0:24 |
| (breath on mic) you are feeling about it. | 0:26 | |
| I'd have to say to you I hadn't looked on that | 0:30 | |
| as the important issue. | 0:35 | |
| Not nearly as important | 0:38 | |
| as the chance to | 0:40 | |
| work with | 0:42 | |
| members of my community who may not see the matter | 0:43 | |
| of country club membership as you do. | 0:46 | |
| And to cut myself off from that, | 0:49 | |
| I hadn't seen, | 0:51 | |
| and don't see it as a wise thing. | 0:52 | |
| Huck | How do you (rustling) | 0:54 |
| To help this situation for these people | 0:57 | |
| (rustling) | 1:00 | |
| Dr. Knight | In a great many ways that I can't | 1:04 |
| put on television and tape for ya. | 1:07 | |
| - | The question was, what has Dr. Knight done in the past | 1:10 |
| to ease the racial tensions in the Hope Valley Country Club, | 1:12 | |
| Dr. Knight continues. | 1:15 | |
| Dr. Knight | No. | 1:19 |
| - | Dr. Knight, | 1:23 |
| Dr. Knight | Yes, | 1:24 |
| why can't you give us a promise | 1:25 | |
| That Duke University will give a higher wage | 1:26 | |
| before we plan an new building programs? | 1:28 | |
| Don't people's lives come before buildings? | 1:32 | |
| (cross talk) | 1:34 | |
| Dr. Knight | Now, now, | 1:35 |
| listen to me. | 1:36 | |
| This is exactly the kinda thing | 1:38 | |
| we've been doing for the last five years | 1:40 | |
| and we have every intention of going on doing. | 1:42 | |
| The money is to get quite specific. | 1:45 | |
| Huck | What is the minimum wage? | 1:47 |
| Dr. Knight | To get quite specific. | 1:49 |
| Those salaries have gone up | 1:52 | |
| 50 percent in the last five years. | 1:53 | |
| I'm not trying to justify- | 1:55 | |
| All right. | 1:56 | |
| All right. | 1:57 | |
| This has to be done | 2:00 | |
| in relationship, | 2:03 | |
| not to the buildings you're speaking of Huck, | 2:03 | |
| because the money for the buildings | 2:05 | |
| doesn't come from the same source. | 2:07 | |
| The money for faculty salaries does. | 2:09 | |
| And there, | 2:13 | |
| we have to work out this constant | 2:15 | |
| balance between the human needs. | 2:18 | |
| And I don't think | 2:21 | |
| that's an immoral | 2:22 | |
| or amoral position to take. | 2:24 | |
| We not only have worked at it, | 2:27 | |
| we intend to go right on working at it. | 2:29 | |
| It's perfectly clear to me that this has to be | 2:32 | |
| as high a priority as anything. | 2:33 | |
| in the university. | 2:36 | |
| I can't say to you this is the one thing | 2:37 | |
| we do to the exclusion of everything else. | 2:39 | |
| That wouldn't be true. | 2:41 | |
| And it wouldn't be fair to the whole place, | 2:43 | |
| or even to the people who | 2:45 | |
| work in a non-academic job. | 2:46 | |
| - | (mumbled outrage) | 2:51 |
| Dr. Knight | Let's not let it degenerate into that. | 2:52 |
| That isn't going to solve | 2:54 | |
| what I gather you want to solve. | 2:55 | |
| - | Dr. Knight's response to what you just heard | 2:57 |
| was in response to a question posed from the floor | 2:59 | |
| to the extent of: | 3:02 | |
| Dr. Knight, how can you live in this expensive house, | 3:04 | |
| this 500 thousand dollar house, | 3:07 | |
| I believe was the sum, | 3:08 | |
| when other people that work for university are | 3:09 | |
| living in slums? | 3:12 | |
| This question was met with a great deal of displeasure | 3:13 | |
| by the people in the audience | 3:16 | |
| that did not feel it was the proper line of questioning. | 3:17 | |
| We continue. | 3:19 | |
| (cross talk) | 3:20 | |
| - | The reason, | 3:27 |
| one of the reasons I'm very concerned about this, | 3:28 | |
| and about some of the remarks you make, | 3:30 | |
| for instance with the country club | 3:32 | |
| to me, it's the least important issue. | 3:35 | |
| Dr. Knight | Right. | 3:37 |
| - | (banging) | 3:38 |
| - | This is Jack Boger questioning from the floor. | 3:39 |
| Jack | Worries me a great deal in this respect. | 3:41 |
| When I talked about an old (mumbles) that had changed | 3:43 | |
| Dr. Knight | Mm hmm | 3:47 |
| Jack | what I meant is this, | 3:48 |
| tonight, in Washington, | 3:50 | |
| the machine guns are on Capitol Hill. | 3:52 | |
| the time has come. | 3:54 | |
| When this country has become polarized | 3:56 | |
| to a certain extant. | 3:59 | |
| Polarized. | 4:00 | |
| Now, that's bad, | 4:01 | |
| but it's here. | 4:03 | |
| Partially. | 4:05 | |
| I'd hate to see a further polarization | 4:06 | |
| at the same time, | 4:08 | |
| a time when men realize there's certain elements in society | 4:10 | |
| they're gonna work for, | 4:14 | |
| or, are they gonna work for other elements. | 4:15 | |
| And when you say that you | 4:17 | |
| won't stay in this country club | 4:19 | |
| to deal with interests in this community | 4:20 | |
| it may be that we've come to a time | 4:23 | |
| where we're gonna have to start working, | 4:25 | |
| start working out positions. | 4:27 | |
| To some of us, | 4:29 | |
| aims of these people in the community- | 4:30 | |
| Dr. Knight | See, I think my finger stands on that side. | 4:32 |
| (applause) | 4:34 | |
| - | Jack Boger asking President Knight to take a stand | 4:38 |
| on his membership in the Hope Valley Country Club. | 4:40 | |
| The crowd responded quite positively. | 4:43 | |
| To this demand on Boger's part. | 4:45 | |
| From the floor as Dr. Knight prepares to speak. | 4:47 | |
| Dr. Knight | Is not, | 4:50 |
| that is not a fair representation of it. | 4:51 | |
| Jack | You said you would not say those things tomorrow. | 4:54 |
| Dr. Knight | I said I had some other things | 4:55 |
| that I felt were also truly important. | 4:57 | |
| - | That's what I just said. | 4:59 |
| Dr. Knight | All right. | 5:00 |
| But that doesn't say I'm not talking about these , | 5:02 | |
| I've already talked about these, | 5:04 | |
| and answered your question. | 5:06 | |
| (crowd talking) | 5:07 | |
| I've tried to say a little about them to you. | 5:08 | |
| And I'm willing to try to say a lot more, | 5:12 | |
| but not in this setting. | 5:14 | |
| Not in this way. | 5:17 | |
| Jack | All I'm saying to you is that | 5:19 |
| you will say to me | 5:20 | |
| "Why not, why not right now, right this minute?" | 5:22 | |
| Dr. Knight | All I'm saying to you is that | 5:25 |
| to put real substance to that meaningful action | 5:27 | |
| isn't something that we | 5:32 | |
| pull out of | 5:34 | |
| this kind of setting | 5:35 | |
| this kind of moment. | 5:36 | |
| And maybe I'm saying to you, | 5:38 | |
| nothing more in present. | 5:40 | |
| Like many of you, | 5:42 | |
| I've made the mistake of staying up too many nights | 5:46 | |
| to one in the morning, | 5:50 | |
| trying to do some of the university's business. | 5:51 | |
| Maybe I'm just, | 5:53 | |
| plain weary enough | 5:55 | |
| not to do a good job | 5:57 | |
| of articulating | 5:59 | |
| the things that | 6:01 | |
| all of want to get out in the open. | 6:02 | |
| But let me point this out to you also. | 6:04 | |
| You've said "Take a stand. We must do something, | 6:07 | |
| meaningful, significant, dramatic." | 6:10 | |
| You express what all of us in the country feel, | 6:13 | |
| I think,. | 6:17 | |
| You express, | 6:19 | |
| a frustration almost beyond belief | 6:21 | |
| that we can't solve | 6:24 | |
| or seemingly can't solve | 6:26 | |
| what's so obviously right in front of us. | 6:28 | |
| And, I can't pretend to you | 6:31 | |
| that tonight, | 6:34 | |
| even if I were, | 6:37 | |
| rested instead of exhausted, | 6:39 | |
| that you're exhausted, | 6:42 | |
| I can't pretend to you I've got | 6:43 | |
| all the answers to that. | 6:45 | |
| I would say this: | 6:46 | |
| I've got answers to some of the specific questions | 6:48 | |
| you raised this evening. | 6:50 | |
| I've got some other suggestions, | 6:52 | |
| and in particular, | 6:54 | |
| I would like to suggest, | 6:56 | |
| the kind of combined, | 6:59 | |
| organizations | 7:02 | |
| that can try to find out inside the university | 7:04 | |
| what is meaningful. | 7:06 | |
| As the (mumbles) in our society, | 7:08 | |
| that was one of those things that used to get to me. | 7:09 | |
| It seems to me, | 7:12 | |
| the soundest kind of idea. | 7:14 | |
| Because I don't believe | 7:17 | |
| granted that tonight is a night of terrible violence | 7:18 | |
| of one kind of after a previous night of | 7:22 | |
| individual violence. | 7:24 | |
| I don't believe the meaning we're all looking for | 7:28 | |
| can be found, expressed and carried out in one evening. | 7:32 | |
| I'm not trying to put you off. | 7:35 | |
| I'm telling you the truth. | 7:38 | |
| You think, you have the answers to this. | 7:39 | |
| Then I, | 7:44 | |
| admire you. | 7:45 | |
| I know I don't, I think I've got | 7:47 | |
| some parts of answers. | 7:49 | |
| I think I know | 7:52 | |
| where the limitations | 7:54 | |
| of my own power to do something about the (mumbles) | 7:55 | |
| I can't help those limitations | 7:59 | |
| any more then you can help some of yours. | 8:01 | |
| But I'd like the chance to work this out with you, | 8:04 | |
| in an orderly way. | 8:07 | |
| In an orderly way. | 8:10 | |
| (applause) | 8:11 | |
| - | Thank you Dr. Knight | 8:13 |
| - | You when you talked to Mr. Macklemare | 8:18 |
| were acting in a big person way | 8:21 | |
| Dr. Knight | I said as a little person. | 8:23 |
| I said as a little person, excuse me. | 8:24 | |
| - | All right, as a little person. | 8:25 |
| Dr. Knight | Thank you | 8:26 |
| But not as we little people could do something. | 8:27 | |
| Whereas you, as a little person who represents all of us, | 8:30 | |
| Dr. Knight | Right. | 8:34 |
| - | So, then say something symbolic, dramatic, | 8:35 |
| outside the institution. | 8:37 | |
| Don't let the institution (mumbles) this time. | 8:39 | |
| Say something that you mean | 8:43 | |
| that we cannot say. | 8:44 | |
| (applause) | 8:46 | |
| - | Tonight, Dr. Knight has made it clear to | 8:48 |
| exhaustion, I think we're all tired. | 8:51 | |
| But he is going to speak tomorrow. | 8:53 | |
| And I think we, as students and faculty, | 8:55 | |
| have some decisions to make right now, | 8:57 | |
| on what our response is. | 8:59 | |
| To this. | 9:02 | |
| - | To Reverend Dr. King, | 9:07 |
| and since 1964 Washington, | 9:09 | |
| and one of his finest moments, | 9:11 | |
| he got up and told the whole nation that he had a dream, | 9:13 | |
| that someday, someday in this country | 9:16 | |
| all men would be equal. | 9:19 | |
| And that's why were here. | 9:21 | |
| And we have that dream. | 9:22 | |
| - | The following is a recorded press conference | 9:30 |
| which was held by Dr. John Strange, | 9:34 | |
| Miss Bunny Small and Mr. Jon Kinney | 9:36 | |
| on Monday. | 9:39 | |
| Dr. Strange | One of the most inspected acts | 9:42 |
| in Duke's history. | 9:44 | |
| A silent vigil is being observed on the main Duke campus | 9:46 | |
| in the name of Dr. Martin Luther King. | 9:50 | |
| This demonstration seeks to force the university | 9:53 | |
| to entrance itself to political and social inequality | 9:55 | |
| by taking four specific steps. | 9:59 | |
| We've asked that Dr. Knight sign an advertisement | 10:01 | |
| be carried in the Durham Morning Herald | 10:05 | |
| calling for a day of mourning for Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. | 10:07 | |
| And asking citizens of Durham to do all they can | 10:11 | |
| to bring about racial equality and freedom. | 10:13 | |
| We've asked that Dr. Knight seek as hard as he can | 10:16 | |
| to establish a dollar and 60 minimum wa- | 10:21 | |
| students, faculty and workers, | 10:32 | |
| to make recommendations, | 10:34 | |
| concerning collective bargaining | 10:35 | |
| and union recognition at Duke. | 10:37 | |
| 250 students went to Dr. Knight's house Friday, | 10:40 | |
| to discuss just these problems. | 10:43 | |
| In going, these students | 10:45 | |
| seized upon an opportunity | 10:47 | |
| to firmly plead with | 10:48 | |
| and to encourage their president | 10:50 | |
| to lead this institution | 10:52 | |
| in response to community crisis. | 10:53 | |
| Sunday morning, | 10:56 | |
| an expression of sympathy for the president's illness | 10:57 | |
| and preserve our commitment and to involve more students | 11:00 | |
| we moved the main quadrangle. | 11:04 | |
| We're seeking to demonstrate a non-violent solution- | 11:06 | |
| hills, | 11:10 | |
| (audio distortion) | 11:11 | |
| We are fully committed to remain here | 11:13 | |
| and to conduct this non-violent vigil, | 11:16 | |
| until Duke University assumes it's responsibility | 11:19 | |
| for racial equality and freedom | 11:21 | |
| in the community that it helps to create. | 11:23 | |
| Mr. Kinney | Thank you Dr. Strange. | 11:27 |
| Ms. Small. | 11:29 | |
| Ms. Small | (audio cuts) respond to questions | 11:31 |
| Mr. Kinney | You just wanna go straight to questions? | 11:36 |
| Okay, fine, questions from the pre- | 11:39 | |
| - | How long do you (rustle) this vigil up? | 11:44 |
| Dr. Strange | We don't know how long it'll be necessary. | 11:47 |
| But, I think it will continue until | 11:49 | |
| there is positive response by the university. | 11:51 | |
| - | Is this an ultimatum? (mumbles) | 11:55 |
| Dr. Strange | We have every hope | 12:00 |
| and every reason to believe | 12:02 | |
| the university can and will | 12:05 | |
| take this opportunity to respond. | 12:07 | |
| Numerous political leaders, | 12:11 | |
| throughout the country, | 12:12 | |
| in light of the, | 12:13 | |
| situation that exists today, | 12:15 | |
| and in light of Dr. King's | 12:18 | |
| death | 12:20 | |
| have, have taken unusual, | 12:22 | |
| dramatic steps, | 12:24 | |
| to indicate their concern with | 12:27 | |
| and (audio distortion) their determination., | 12:29 | |
| to solve the problems | 12:32 | |
| of their own particular situations, | 12:33 | |
| or this country. | 12:35 | |
| We think this university will likewise respond. | 12:36 | |
| Ms. Small | I think there's one addition | 12:40 |
| I'd like to make | 12:41 | |
| we will not (audio distortion) | 12:43 | |
| we are not standing | 12:49 | |
| against the university | 12:52 | |
| and against the administration | 12:54 | |
| as such. | 12:56 | |
| We have come here, | 12:58 | |
| in what one might call, | 12:59 | |
| an act of faith, | 13:00 | |
| that the university | 13:02 | |
| might respond (audio cut) | 13:03 | |
| leadership we seek, | 13:06 | |
| in moves of action, | 13:09 | |
| as we've gone beyond the time for (mumbles). | 13:11 | |
| and that we seek in faith, | 13:13 | |
| that our university responded to provide | 13:16 | |
| the leadership that we need. | 13:18 | |
| - | Are negotiations presently underway | 13:21 |
| with the university officials? | 13:23 | |
| Dr. Strange | Yes, we will be meeting | 13:28 |
| this afternoon, | 13:30 | |
| probably with Dr. Knight's representatives | 13:31 | |
| before a four o'clock meeting | 13:34 | |
| that is scheduled with Dr. Knight | 13:36 | |
| if his health, | 13:38 | |
| if he is physically able to meet with us | 13:39 | |
| at that time, | 13:41 | |
| or shortly there after. | 13:42 | |
| But we have been contacted | 13:44 | |
| we probably will be meeting | 13:45 | |
| or at least talking over the phone | 13:46 | |
| for a period of time this afternoon | 13:47 | |
| with some people from the administration. | 13:49 | |
| - | And you plan to meet Dr. Knight | 13:52 |
| Dr. Strange | If he is able. | 13:54 |
| Yes, or shortly there after. | 13:55 | |
| - | Can you elaborate on this vigil as to | 13:56 |
| well, you know what's going on, | 14:00 | |
| are these students going to sit there, | 14:01 | |
| day and night, | 14:04 | |
| and is food going to be brought to them? | 14:05 | |
| Are they going to attend classes? | 14:07 | |
| Cut classes? | 14:08 | |
| Or just what type of action is going on? | 14:09 | |
| Dr. Strange | Well the procedure which is now | 14:12 |
| followed is that the students are | 14:13 | |
| remaining on the campus | 14:15 | |
| on the quadrangle. | 14:17 | |
| They have a break about every 45 minutes, | 14:19 | |
| to stand and sing during intermission of classes. | 14:21 | |
| Food is being provided by faculty members. | 14:24 | |
| There's a smaller group coordinating this. | 14:26 | |
| The East Campus Co-Eds. | 14:29 | |
| The students slept out last night | 14:31 | |
| and if necessary, | 14:35 | |
| this will be continued. | 14:37 | |
| - | And they're not attending classes. | 14:39 |
| Dr. Strange | No they have- | 14:41 |
| they did not attend classes today. | 14:42 | |
| - | How many students are out of the | 14:43 |
| what percentage are involved with this? | 14:45 | |
| Are behind this? | 14:48 | |
| Dr. Strange | Out of the student body? | 14:49 |
| - | Right. | 14:50 |
| Dr. Strange | That are participating directly? | 14:51 |
| - | Right. | 14:52 |
| Dr. Strange | About 15 percent. | 14:57 |
| - | And what has been the reaction | 15:01 |
| of those who have not joined? | 15:02 | |
| Mr. Kinney | Well, devising to speak, just generally, | 15:04 |
| for every student out there, | 15:08 | |
| we probably have one other student working logistics | 15:09 | |
| whether it's writing statements, | 15:12 | |
| whether it's gathering food, | 15:13 | |
| whether it's getting sleeping blankets, | 15:15 | |
| whether it's taking petitions around to faculty, | 15:16 | |
| people they feel cannot spend | 15:19 | |
| that amount of time there themselves, | 15:21 | |
| but are committed, | 15:23 | |
| and we do need these people | 15:24 | |
| of course, for political logistics, | 15:25 | |
| and problems such as this. | 15:27 | |
| So if you take this, | 15:28 | |
| from what I can gather, | 15:30 | |
| the overwhelming majority of the student body | 15:31 | |
| is at least, backing the demands | 15:35 | |
| that we are asking for. | 15:36 | |
| A few question the tactics, | 15:38 | |
| but I think, even there we have the support. | 15:40 | |
| This is unprecedented | 15:42 | |
| in Duke's history and tradition. | 15:44 | |
| I mean to have more then | 15:47 | |
| I think the largest demonstration | 15:48 | |
| of any sort or vigil | 15:50 | |
| has never been over a hundred students before. | 15:52 | |
| So when you have 500 participating | 15:54 | |
| and this 500 shifts at times | 15:56 | |
| because mainly it's the same group | 15:58 | |
| but sometimes people do come in and join us | 16:02 | |
| and some people do leave for short times, | 16:04 | |
| they do have | 16:06 | |
| you know, they go off, take a break, | 16:07 | |
| we've asked them to call home to their parents | 16:10 | |
| to explain the situation, | 16:12 | |
| and to call their friends | 16:14 | |
| they feel may be able to influence things. | 16:16 | |
| So people are asking to leave to make specific calls, | 16:18 | |
| do specific things that we're asking, | 16:22 | |
| go into to town to get paper, pencils, material | 16:24 | |
| go back to the dorm to get books | 16:26 | |
| for people to study, | 16:28 | |
| such as this. | 16:29 | |
| Ms. Small | And I have been speaking this morning with | 16:30 |
| some of the people that | 16:33 | |
| do not support | 16:36 | |
| the actions | 16:38 | |
| or necessarily, the goals that we are seeking | 16:39 | |
| and among the those of whom I have been speaking | 16:44 | |
| at this time, | 16:48 | |
| their mood is, | 16:49 | |
| I would say, | 16:51 | |
| overwhelmingly tolerant. | 16:53 | |
| The group of students who are | 16:55 | |
| antagonistic to what we are doing | 16:56 | |
| represents a very small portion of the university. | 16:59 | |
| Those who are not supporting us in some concrete way, | 17:01 | |
| or through signed statements of support, | 17:05 | |
| are at least neutral and tolerant. | 17:08 | |
| There are very few antagonistic | 17:11 | |
| - | For you this, | 17:13 |
| the demonstration of the individuals seem to be | 17:14 | |
| extremely well organized | 17:16 | |
| and as you've said, there must be | 17:18 | |
| a lot of logistics and maybe... | 17:19 | |
| But where are you getting you're money form? | 17:22 | |
| To feed these people? | 17:25 | |
| Mr. Kinney | All the, all the money we | 17:26 |
| originally asked for money to put an ad | 17:29 | |
| in the Durham Morning Herald tomorrow. | 17:30 | |
| This money has been raised from contributions | 17:32 | |
| from faculty members, from students, | 17:35 | |
| from people there themselves, | 17:37 | |
| from walking along the quad. | 17:38 | |
| For instance, from people in the libraries, | 17:40 | |
| from students working in the libraries said | 17:42 | |
| we're gonna be fired if we go out here, | 17:44 | |
| but can I write you a check? | 17:45 | |
| And they sat down and wrote out checks for five dollars | 17:46 | |
| and another one (mumbles) for ten. | 17:49 | |
| So this is the some of the support we're getting. | 17:52 | |
| Food, basically, has been supplied by faculty wise, | 17:54 | |
| by some employees, | 17:57 | |
| by East Campus Co-Eds, | 17:58 | |
| by some of the girls, | 18:00 | |
| this has not been a problem, | 18:01 | |
| up till now, | 18:02 | |
| we're raising money, | 18:04 | |
| we did send some money after the memorial service | 18:06 | |
| to Mrs. King, over a hundred dollars, | 18:08 | |
| for her use, | 18:09 | |
| in terms, the university also had a service | 18:11 | |
| and we participated in the service | 18:13 | |
| while we were at Dr. Knight's home. | 18:14 | |
| - | And you're circulating petitions | 18:17 |
| among the various departments for faculty support. | 18:19 | |
| Is this true? | 18:21 | |
| Mr. Kinney | That's correct. | 18:22 |
| Yes sir. | 18:23 | |
| - | What has been the response so far? | 18:24 |
| Mr. Kinney | I don't know. | 18:26 |
| We've collected a large number of signatures, | 18:27 | |
| I've had (mumbles) to the idea that the number or | 18:32 | |
| the percentage or anything of this sort, | 18:36 | |
| has been quite favorable. | 18:39 | |
| - | Is this basically and reaction to Dr. Martin Luther King? | 18:41 |
| That it is his death, | 18:45 | |
| is symbolic of something is wrong with our society? | 18:47 | |
| This is what you're protesting on. | 18:49 | |
| And these grievances are the tangible, | 18:51 | |
| contiguous | 18:55 | |
| problems of things you could come up with here. | 18:58 | |
| Is that the basic philosophy beneath the whole thing? | 19:02 | |
| Dr. Strange | I think that Dr. King's death | 19:05 |
| certainly was the stimulant for this action | 19:07 | |
| that's been taken. | 19:10 | |
| It is both a protest of the ills of our | 19:12 | |
| country and of the city and of | 19:17 | |
| the particular institution of which we reside, | 19:19 | |
| but it's also a request | 19:22 | |
| and seeking to create | 19:25 | |
| or to actually, | 19:28 | |
| set up a situation of leadership | 19:32 | |
| to make dramatic steps, | 19:34 | |
| that will alleviate some of the problems, | 19:38 | |
| and to reassure our Black brethren | 19:40 | |
| that changes can be made | 19:43 | |
| in a short period of time, | 19:47 | |
| in a meaningful way, | 19:48 | |
| without having given up on the system. | 19:50 | |
| What concerns the students, I think, | 19:53 | |
| and what concerns a lot of people in the country | 19:57 | |
| is that we've reached a point where | 19:58 | |
| violence seems to be the last tactic that | 20:01 | |
| is being used to achieve change | 20:04 | |
| and a lot of people have just writ off the political system. | 20:07 | |
| As no longer being able to bring that change. | 20:10 | |
| But we hate to think that's true. | 20:13 | |
| And we think the political systems, | 20:16 | |
| whether they be city governments, | 20:18 | |
| or state governments, | 20:20 | |
| or federal governments, | 20:21 | |
| or even institutions such as Duke University, | 20:22 | |
| can, and will respond | 20:25 | |
| to situations of urgency | 20:27 | |
| and do, and are concerned about the problems of the Negro. | 20:28 | |
| And I think that's the, that's the situation | 20:32 | |
| we have here today that | 20:35 | |
| that there should be a response | 20:36 | |
| and that there will be a response | 20:38 | |
| and that non-violence, peaceful, demonstrations, | 20:39 | |
| are much better and more productive then | 20:44 | |
| any other type of activity. | 20:48 | |
| If that's not true, | 20:50 | |
| and it's a very difficult world we live in | 20:54 | |
| and it's very sad for us to have to come to | 20:56 | |
| those measures. | 20:58 | |
| Ms. Small | I'd like to just one thing | 20:59 |
| from a student point of view, | 21:01 | |
| on this point that Dr. Strange has been making. | 21:02 | |
| Because, I think that this is exactly what | 21:04 | |
| the vigil represents. | 21:08 | |
| It represents, when a predominantly | 21:09 | |
| White middle-class students | 21:13 | |
| saying to themselves, to the rest of the community, | 21:15 | |
| to Durham, to North Carolina, | 21:17 | |
| to this country, | 21:19 | |
| that we are going to try for Dr. Martin Luther King's way, | 21:21 | |
| to see if the system can respond. | 21:25 | |
| Many Black Americans have given up. | 21:28 | |
| But if the system cannot respond to | 21:31 | |
| the White middle-class, who is the system for? | 21:33 | |
| And I think you have a lot of conscience | 21:37 | |
| out on the quad. | 21:39 | |
| You have a great deal of commitment, | 21:40 | |
| and in many cases, | 21:43 | |
| it may be the last stand. | 21:46 | |
| - | Well I think they, | 21:49 |
| the people how may oppose to what you're doing, | 21:50 | |
| and I'm not talking of the people here at Duke (mumbles) | 21:52 | |
| they tell you sincerely, | 21:55 | |
| they're questioning your maturity, | 21:57 | |
| things like this, | 21:59 | |
| I don't know if anybody has an answer to that question, | 22:04 | |
| but it seems like they are | 22:08 | |
| they were maybe having the same reasons, | 22:11 | |
| well not the same reasons, but similar reasons | 22:14 | |
| when they were your age, | 22:16 | |
| but there are many hidden pressures | 22:18 | |
| that you encounter as you get older, | 22:20 | |
| as you try to live, | 22:22 | |
| and what I think concerns a lot of them is | 22:26 | |
| what are you going to be like, | 22:28 | |
| not now, ten years from now? | 22:29 | |
| Are you still believe this? | 22:31 | |
| Because if you will, | 22:32 | |
| we're gonna have a great society. | 22:33 | |
| This is the way they feel. | 22:35 | |
| But they don't look at I that way, | 22:36 | |
| they look at you as agitators and that's it. | 22:37 | |
| Ms. Small | I think that if, | 22:39 |
| if the institutions | 22:43 | |
| and the leadership does no respond | 22:46 | |
| that we won't be like we are in ten years, | 22:48 | |
| whether or not some of us will just give up, | 22:52 | |
| and sink back into the quagmire | 22:55 | |
| of American society at this time, | 22:57 | |
| is the question whether or not other of us | 22:59 | |
| will leave the country, | 23:02 | |
| or whether we'll do something else remaining here. | 23:03 | |
| This is a completely open future. | 23:07 | |
| In order for us | 23:10 | |
| to be the good things that we are now | 23:12 | |
| in terms of taking moral stands | 23:16 | |
| and suffering some personal inconveniences then | 23:19 | |
| experiencing a little self sacrifice | 23:24 | |
| in order for us to be those people | 23:25 | |
| ten and 15 years from now. | 23:28 | |
| The country today is going to have to | 23:30 | |
| make a response to the situations | 23:32 | |
| in society. | 23:33 | |
| And not a response that makes | 23:35 | |
| a few committees, | 23:37 | |
| or appoints another investigation, | 23:38 | |
| but a response that gets to the root of | 23:41 | |
| why society is like it is, | 23:43 | |
| and changes those problems. | 23:45 | |
| - | A group of students yesterday in Raleigh | 23:48 |
| barricaded themselves in the state house | 23:50 | |
| Some of these students from UNC and State | 23:52 | |
| Were any of this group involved in that? | 23:55 | |
| Mr. Kinney | No sir. | 23:58 |
| Yes. | 24:02 | |
| - | I'm curious as to what is this connected still (mumbles) | 24:03 |
| this demonstration, like the national context | 24:05 | |
| like the whole looting and rioting that's going on | 24:07 | |
| since Dr. King's death? | 24:10 | |
| When you see that offensive thing that | 24:13 | |
| whatever you do here, now | 24:15 | |
| is sort of a paltry thing | 24:17 | |
| comparison to some great speculative events | 24:18 | |
| that's been going on. | 24:20 | |
| Dr. Strange | Well my comment to | 24:22 |
| we don't know much of what's going on, | 24:23 | |
| since we haven't read the newspapers | 24:25 | |
| or we've heard very few radio broadcasts | 24:26 | |
| we do get a sense, | 24:30 | |
| somebody said the other day, | 24:31 | |
| 46 cities were burning down, | 24:32 | |
| or something of the sort. | 24:34 | |
| I don't really know this is true. | 24:36 | |
| I think the concerns of the students here, | 24:38 | |
| are that | 24:42 | |
| that we have to take action | 24:45 | |
| which will bring about response, | 24:48 | |
| and we do not believe at this time | 24:50 | |
| that action which is called for or | 24:54 | |
| even is necessary or is productive, | 24:56 | |
| is one which is violent. | 24:58 | |
| That is when you've given up. | 25:00 | |
| And said "Light it off." | 25:02 | |
| These students don't believe that yet. | 25:05 | |
| But, at some point, | 25:07 | |
| I'm afraid that they may come to believe that. | 25:08 | |
| They may be right, | 25:12 | |
| which is the frightening thing about it. | 25:13 | |
| It would really be sad if that were the case. | 25:16 | |
| - | What has been the reaction of | 25:20 |
| the Negro community in Durham | 25:22 | |
| and do you think that | 25:23 | |
| your attempting to do something constructive | 25:25 | |
| while on the Duke campus itself | 25:28 | |
| can hold down the violence in Durham? | 25:30 | |
| Mr. Kinney | You want to comment John? | 25:36 |
| Dr. Strange | Well, I think it's awfully difficult | 25:37 |
| to comment about what action at | 25:39 | |
| one pick would place means | 25:41 | |
| at holding down violence in Durham. | 25:43 | |
| There are a lot of factors here | 25:45 | |
| that have worked to hold down the violence in Durham. | 25:46 | |
| The great, excellent organizational work | 25:49 | |
| which has been carried out by | 25:50 | |
| Operation Breakthrough and UOCI, | 25:52 | |
| where there are communication patterns, | 25:54 | |
| where there are direct channels | 25:56 | |
| of communication between | 26:01 | |
| the city leadership and the Black community. | 26:05 | |
| The history of non-violent, | 26:10 | |
| peaceful protest in Durham, | 26:12 | |
| all these factors play a part. | 26:14 | |
| I think that the Black community | 26:17 | |
| basically, is quite interested | 26:18 | |
| first of all, if anything like this occurred, | 26:20 | |
| they more or less though that Duke | 26:22 | |
| was out of it. | 26:24 | |
| Second, they, the militant Black community | 26:25 | |
| was probably somewhat amused by the tactics | 26:29 | |
| which were being used, | 26:32 | |
| they were, as you suggested, | 26:33 | |
| somewhat paltry and somewhat less advanced | 26:34 | |
| then those which are now being advocated | 26:39 | |
| by certain groups like (mumbles). | 26:41 | |
| They've certainly been surprised | 26:44 | |
| from their comments to me | 26:45 | |
| that we've stuck with it as long as we've had, | 26:47 | |
| I think they thought that White middle-class students | 26:49 | |
| couldn't take it for three days, | 26:53 | |
| and there may be even more surprises | 26:56 | |
| to see how long students can stay out. | 26:58 | |
| And I think that if there is | 27:01 | |
| a constructive, direct response, | 27:04 | |
| to the requests which we've made, | 27:06 | |
| and other problems which the university's aware of, | 27:08 | |
| that they will first of all, | 27:11 | |
| have a different attitude about Duke, | 27:13 | |
| one which is much more positive, | 27:15 | |
| then it has been in the past, | 27:17 | |
| two, that they will have a greater respect | 27:18 | |
| for the types of procedures which we've found | 27:21 | |
| and third, that they will reassess their roll | 27:25 | |
| in cooperating and participating | 27:30 | |
| once again, in a mixed or integrated protest movement. | 27:32 | |
| One of the things which is interesting here, | 27:38 | |
| is that those groups of people, | 27:40 | |
| those students and others, | 27:43 | |
| that would press for the most abrasive type of tactics, | 27:44 | |
| have been amazed by the support which we have garnered, | 27:51 | |
| both from faculty and students, | 27:55 | |
| by a very deescalated type of approach | 27:57 | |
| to the whole situation, | 28:00 | |
| and I think they're reassessing | 28:02 | |
| their attitudes about the way | 28:04 | |
| in which you approach these problems, | 28:06 | |
| and I think the students who have participated | 28:08 | |
| are reassessing their attitudes about the necessity | 28:10 | |
| to confront institutions and individuals, | 28:14 | |
| with the situations that exist. | 28:18 | |
| I think it's been a dramatic learning experience | 28:22 | |
| for all involved. | 28:24 | |
| What frightens me is, | 28:25 | |
| and I certainly don't think we need to think | 28:28 | |
| of this possibility | 28:30 | |
| but should it ever arise, | 28:31 | |
| it just | 28:33 | |
| a totally native response by the university | 28:36 | |
| as I said, | 28:39 | |
| I don't think, nor do I, | 28:40 | |
| and I certainly don't hope this will be the case, | 28:42 | |
| if that were the case | 28:44 | |
| these students would really be affected. | 28:47 | |
| And I think they'd remember it for a long time. | 28:50 | |
| It would undercut a great deal of hope, | 28:51 | |
| which they have, | 28:54 | |
| but their university does recognize | 28:56 | |
| and is committed to bringing about change, | 28:58 | |
| and that it will do so. | 29:01 | |
| - | With violence going on all across the country, | 29:04 |
| how do you manage to keep the Duke students | 29:07 | |
| as passive as they have been? | 29:09 | |
| Ms. Small | Hope. | 29:12 |
| Hope takes it's live stand at times | 29:14 | |
| and (mumbles) they are | 29:15 | |
| the commitment is overwhelming. | 29:19 | |
| Every time we go out there to say something to them, | 29:21 | |
| the spirit and the faith in us | 29:24 | |
| that the evidence | 29:26 | |
| is just | 29:27 | |
| well it's just overwhelming. | 29:29 | |
| There's just no other way to describe it. | 29:30 | |
| And they, | 29:32 | |
| they have hope that there will be | 29:35 | |
| a positive response, | 29:38 | |
| and that, | 29:40 | |
| what the more valuable people call liberal illusions | 29:41 | |
| will be proven true. | 29:44 | |
| If they're not, | 29:46 | |
| Mr. Kinney | You don't even have to believe us on this. | 29:47 |
| I just ask that you go out there on the quad | 29:50 | |
| and mingle with the people, | 29:52 | |
| and find out what we're finding | 29:54 | |
| and | 29:55 | |
| Ms. Small | They won't talk to them. | 29:57 |
| Mr. Kinney | What? | 29:58 |
| Ms. Small | They won't talk to them. | 29:59 |
| Mr. Kinney | Well, ask people to come out. | 30:00 |
| Ask monitors to bring people out. | 30:02 | |
| Ms. Small | It's okay (mumbles) | 30:04 |
| (laughs) | 30:05 | |
| - | What was the reaction of Duke students | 30:08 |
| when Edward Brown made a speech last Monday night | 30:10 | |
| as a crowd of people (mumbles) | 30:12 | |
| Dr. Strange | You mean at (mumbles) Page (mumbles)? | 30:17 |
| - | Yes. | 30:19 |
| - | Hal's speaking. | |
| Dr. Strange | You want to know if Frank answers that? | 30:21 |
| - | Yeah | 30:22 |
| Dr. Strange | I think that the students | 30:23 |
| primarily were concerned that Mr. Pal didn't arrive, | 30:25 | |
| that was their- | 30:30 | |
| - | They didn't get anything other | 30:31 |
| then Brown's statement at all | 30:32 | |
| Ms. Small | I think it was a general statement, you know, | 30:33 |
| follow the Negro leadership or else. | 30:35 | |
| Many of us went there | 30:37 | |
| with the belief that at this time, | 30:39 | |
| that the Negro movement had produced | 30:41 | |
| more leaders then | 30:44 | |
| the White movement at this time have, | 30:46 | |
| very willing to follow the Negro leadership, | 30:48 | |
| and as Dr. Strange says, | 30:54 | |
| we didn't get anymore invol;ved in that part | 30:56 | |
| because they didn't tell us to, | 30:58 | |
| where you gonna, where you should follow us, | 30:59 | |
| or what we're gonna do when we get there. | 31:02 | |
| It was more or less a philosophy | 31:04 | |
| which many of us went there quite willing to accept | 31:06 | |
| but because Paul himself was unable to come | 31:08 | |
| for his reasons of health | 31:10 | |
| we weren't able to go beyond that | 31:13 | |
| to the specifics so, | 31:15 | |
| there was no new response. | 31:17 | |
| - | Were their any national instructions (car horns) | 31:21 |
| Dr. Strange | We've gotten several telegrams and letters | 31:24 |
| from people throughout the country | 31:27 | |
| and living number of alumni, | 31:29 | |
| parents of the students involved, | 31:32 | |
| people who had some reason to hear | 31:36 | |
| the events which are occurring. | 31:40 | |
| I'm not sure how widely know nationally | 31:42 | |
| what's happening at Duke is. | 31:43 | |
| With the headlines all about the | 31:46 | |
| burning down of cities, | 31:48 | |
| I doubt that we make the, | 31:50 | |
| much space in news papers | 31:53 | |
| throughout the country. | 31:54 | |
| I don't think there's been any organized effort | 31:55 | |
| to get the message out and (mumbles) | 31:57 | |
| - | Any parents and (crowd noises) for you | 32:00 |
| according to (mumbles) here tomorrow | 32:03 | |
| class do you have (crowd noises) | 32:05 | |
| Dr. Strange | If I remember correctly | 32:07 |
| they were scheduled to speak tonight | 32:08 | |
| to a group on East campus. | 32:11 | |
| I don't know how that program will be effected | 32:12 | |
| in view of the curfew which is imposed in Durham, | 32:15 | |
| I would be surprised if they got into Durham, | 32:19 | |
| if they didn't appear over on West campus, | 32:24 | |
| I can hardly imagine their being here. | 32:26 | |
| - | (mumbles) contact with? | 32:28 |
| Dr. Strange | I think some- | 32:30 |
Item Info
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